ARI SHAPIRO, HOST:
In other parts of the program today, we're hearing about Secretary of State Marco Rubio's visit here and his message about the canal. This morning, Rubio left for El Salvador, and he told reporters traveling with him that he is now the acting director of USAID, the Agency for International Development. NPR State Department correspondent Michele Kelemen is traveling with the secretary. Thanks for joining us.
MICHELE KELEMEN, BYLINE: Nice to be here.
SHAPIRO: What did Rubio say about USAID?
KELEMEN: Well, I mean, basically, he came out saying - accusing the USAID of having a history of ignoring the will of the State Department and deciding that they are, in his words, some sort of global charity separate from U.S. interests. He says the Trump administration is changing that. You know, employees have been sent home. And aid all around the world has been frozen and placed under review. And Rubio defended these actions, saying these are taxpayer dollars, and the Trump administration wants to make sure that the money it's spending abroad aligns with its goals.
But it was really rather surprising, Ari, from someone who has spent a long time on the Senate Foreign Relations Committee and backed aid programs in the past, particularly, you know, humanitarian aid and on human rights issues. But he says that for years, he had concerns about some aid programs that are not aligned with U.S. goals, and he said that is coming to an end.
SHAPIRO: Rubio's first stop on this Latin America trip was here in Panama. As we've been reporting, Trump wants to take it back. That did not happen on this trip, but were any deals made?
KELEMEN: Well, he called it a delicate issue because the president of Panama is a friend of America and a strong partner. That's how Rubio described President Mulino. But he said he did have some frank discussions about the canal and raised particular concerns about China. He said when the U.S. turned over the canal, it turned it over to Panama, not to China, but China has two big ports on either end of the canal. He complained about the Navy having to pay fees to go through it, and he says he wants that to change. But, you know, he didn't come out saying he made any particular progress. He said we will achieve potentially really good things. Time will tell, but he said he felt good about the discussion.
SHAPIRO: Immigration is dominating this trip. What agreements is Rubio hoping to make? Are countries cooperating with the Trump agenda on immigration?
KELEMEN: Yeah. I mean, you know, Panama actually has done a lot to slow illegal migration, cutting back on movements through the Darien Gap by 90%. That happened during the Biden administration. And Rubio went to see a flight of migrants being sent back to Columbia today - 43 people, about 11 women, and one looked rather young. These are not migrants that came to the U.S. They are migrants that were going - that perhaps could have come to the U.S. The U.S. pays for these flights, but remember, there's a freeze on aid. So Rubio said he actually had to issue a waiver to pay for that flight that he saw today.
SHAPIRO: That's NPR's Michele Kelemen, traveling with Secretary of State Marco Rubio. They're in El Salvador right now. Thanks a lot, Michele.
KELEMEN: Thank you. Transcript provided by NPR, Copyright NPR.
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